Teach the Brain Forums

A learning disability is situated in that it results from an interaction of an individual and a specific task.

Consider the example of a deficit in the phonological module of the cortex, which often underlies dyslexia. This deficit is not relevant in all circumstances, such as when an individual is drawing. In fact, there may be situations in which this atypical phonological module is actually an asset. Can you think of any such cases?

Many thanks,
Christina

March 5, 2006

Good Morning,

Special needs children do react to their external environment and their internal environment. The neurologically typical child also does the same, but is not constrained by NOISE or STATIC that precludes a smooth flow of connections.

The special needs child may have few or no connections; thus forging ahead with making new pathways to communicate.
Best,
Rob

Hi Christina,
Thanks for raising this, as this is perhaps my greatest concern with current educational practice?
Disabled or Different?
These 2 simple words define 2 oppositional attitudes and approaches to education?
In an educational environment that genuinely recognises and teaches to Learning Differences, [different ways of learning].
The terms Disabled/ Disorder become obsolete?
If anything, they are a denial of different ways of learning?
A convenient way to isolate and ignore the issue?
Analogous to the 'Too hard basket'.

Rather than recognising and nurturing students different ways of learning.
A child is told that they are Disabled.
A label to be carried for their whole life.
A label that completely undermines their self-esteem and self-confidence in their potential abilities.
Which brings with it an attitude of ; don't bother trying?

What a vastly different situation it would be, if each child was informed that their different way of learning had been identified.
That their education would be structured around their way of learning?
Where the particular strengths that their way of learning offer, are recognised, highlighted and built upon.
As opposed to the current practice, where their area of weakness is used to define them?
Where a child should be defined by their Abilities, not their Disabilities!

Not thick, dumb, disabled, just learn differently with my own strengths!
Geoff.

Hi Geoff,

Thanks so much for this response. I completely agree with your point about the problems with defining a child in terms of weakness in particular situations (now termed disabilities), rather than as a whole child with atypical ways of learning that are only disadvantageous in particular circumstances.

To make this point strongly, I am trying to think of a concrete situation in which a phonological deficit could actually be advantageous. Does anyone have a thought on this?

Thanks very much!

All the best,
Christina

March circa 12, 2006

Good Morning,

Phonological deficit might be an ameliorating factor of itself....let us keep looking. Retrieved today from internet....Not the answer just a thought might occur.
URL: http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/abstract/100/5/2860
URL: http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&...tnG=Search

Best,
Rob

Hi Christina ,
You wrote:"To make this point strongly, I am trying to think of a concrete situation in which a phonological deficit could actually be advantageous. Does anyone have a thought on this?"
In terms of Dyslexics who have a phonological deficit, their is a view that language is primarily processed in working memory, visually rather then audibly?
Dyslexics often argue that visually processing language enhances their creative thinking?
Where it seems that the distinction might be, in the way that working memory 'Chunks' language in its Digit Span?
The old saying:"A picture can explain a thousand words", perhaps reflects the difference?
Dyslexics would argue that they are not bogged down in Words, but are able to think in terms of the 'bigger picture'?
In turn, that bigger picture thinking, provides a greater potential for Creative thinking?
In terms of 'phonological deficit', the real deficit is with the absurd form of written phonemes of English? Which are largely incompatible with visual processing thinkers.
The more logical use of written phonemes in Italian, which has the lowest incidence of Dyslexia in Europe.
Highlights the question of whether the deficit is with written English?
I am aware of english dyslexics, who learnt Italian and Spanish as a second language, and found that they weren't dyslexic in these languages?

So where is their Dyslexia?
But perhaps the greater issue, is with the restirctions on 'ways of thinking' / processing language, that different languages impose? Their compatibility with both visual and verbal working memory thinkers?

Is it a question about Deficit or Difference?

Geoff.

March 13, 2006

Good Morning,

I realize that the question put forth by Christina was serious, but so is this answer since I can find no other. Phonological deficits has called attention to itself and can be evaluated differently than ever before such as the fMRI which found differences from the regular MRI. I have almost no knowledge in this area but am trying to help with the answer...so please be patient...thanks. I have sent an e-mail to CAST...Dr. David Rose..He is really good at this..
Rob

Please take a look at this long long article on reading and the recognition of phonological deficits. Retrieved today via the internet. I realize that this hyperlink does not answer the questions....but might it get us a little closer?

URL: http://www.ldonline.org/ld_indepth/readi...ecode.html

Thanks very much for your interesting responses.

Geoff: I know Matthew Schnepps at the Harvard Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics is doing some work with dyslexia and math and sciences that may be of relevance to your comments regarding visual processing.

Rob: I wrote David Rose as well! He certainly has some wonderful insights on this topic.

All the best,
Christina

An interesting response from Dr. Matthew Schneps:

"I believe clear evidence is emerging in the literature to support the notion that those with dyslexia have talents for certain very narrowly defined visuospatial abilities, and that these talents are important in certain types of reasoning that occur in science and art. However, these talents directly linked to a set of deficits for other visuospatial tasks that hinder cognition in these fields. In the end it is not clear whether the observed talents are sufficiently important to offset the effects of the deficits.

More, generally, looking at this issue holistically, given the tremendous importance of reading in society, the fact that those with dyslexia (by definition) perform poorly on reading-related tasks probably overwhelms any positive effects of talents. But, talents do appear and it is my opinion that these imbue those with dyslexia with a different perspective on ideas that can be useful in many situations."

Thanks so much!

A very interesting article that discusses visual-spatial talent associated with dyslexia:

von Károlyi, C., Winner, E., Gray, W., & Sherman, G. F. (2003). Dyslexia linked to talent: Global visual-spatial ability. Brain & Language, 85, 427-431

Abstract
Dyslexia has long been defined by deficit. Nevertheless, the view that visual-spatial talents accompany dyslexia has grown, due to reports of individuals with dyslexia who possess visual-spatial strengths, findings of elevated incidence of dyslexia in certain visual-spatial professions, and the hypothesis that left-hemisphere deficits accompany right-hemisphere strengths. Studies have reported superior, inferior, and average levels of visual-spatial abilities associated with dyslexia. In two investigations, we found an association between dyslexia and speed of recognition of impossible figures, a global visual-spatial task. This finding suggests that dyslexia is associated with a particular type of visual-spatial talent—enhanced ability to process visual-spatial information globally (holistically) rather than locally (part by part).

Cheers,
Christina

Hi Christina,
Thanks for that article.
In response, I will post a quote from:
I Think in Pictures, You Teach in Words: The Gifted Visual Spatial Learner
by Lesley Sword.
Divergent Thinking – Creativity

"Spatial and sequential thinking are two different mental organisations that affect the way people view the world. The sequential system involves analysis, progression from simple to complex, organization of information and linear deductive reasoning. It is influenced by hearing and language and an awareness of time. Temporal, sequential and analytic functions are thought to be associated with the left hemisphere of the brain. In contrast, spatial thinking involves synthesis, an intuitive grasp of complex systems, (often missing the steps) simultaneous processing of concepts, inductive reasoning (from the whole to the parts), use of imagination and generation of ideas by combining existing facts in new ways (creative thinking). It is influenced by visualisation and images and an awareness of space. Spatial, holistic and synthetic functions are thought to be associated with the right hemisphere of the brain..(West 1991)"
"Whereas left brain thinking is step by step linear thinking over time, right brain thinking is an holistic system where all knowledge is interconnected in space. When left brain thinkers are asked the answer to a question, they will look for the right answer based on the facts at their disposal. When right brain thinkers are asked a question, they usually respond with some form of “tell me more/it depends”. As all their knowledge is connected, they can see many paths to differing answers and they want more information to help them decide which path to take to the required answer. This divergent thinking is the hallmark of creativity but may not be understood in school where achievement is often seen as having the right answer. As Jeffery Freed says “Because one of the attributes of right brained thinking is a non-sequential divergent form of thinking, their minds often veer into unusual and different territory. This can result in illogical or often unsubstantiated conclusions. On the other hand, they may view a problem from an entirely different angle, leading to new breakthroughs and discoveries.” (Freed 1996)

Rather than a 'deficit', it highlights that the fact language can processed primarily in a verbal or visual form?
Where the western model of phonic based written language, is suited to Verbal Thinkers.
As opposed to the Chinese Pictographic model of written language, which is suited to Visual Thinkers.
Which suggests to me that the deficit is with our models of written language?

Though perhaps of greater concern, is any idea of 'curing Dyslexia'?
Which could result in the loss of the unique benefits of Visual Thinking?

I'd also mention 2 Dyslexia forums where the question being discussed, was:
"If you could rid yourself of your Dyslexia, would you?"
Where nearly all respondents replied that; whilst they'd like to not have a difficulty with written text, they would not be prepared to lose their more 'global' way of thinking. Which they hold as a most valued part of their personal identity.

The idea of Dyslexic as a 'deficit', needs to be replaced with a recognition of value that 'difference' brings to our ways of thinking?

Yet on the other side of the coin, we have the maths difficulty of Dyscalculia. Which swing the other way, and are Verbal Thinkers, rather Visual.
Who tend to have exceptional verbal skills in creative writing and speaking.

So that Dyslexics and Dyscalculics, are in fact people with exceptional skills in either Visual or Verbal Thinking? Where this exclusive way of thinking, offers a different way of understanding our world.
Perhaps one day, our gifted Visual and Verbal Thinkers will be seen as an asset?
I would also mention a Poll that I'm conducting on my Dyscalculia Forum, where the question is: " Which is a greater difficulty for you, your Dyscalculia, or other people's lack of understanding of it?"
Where currently the figures are: 20% Dyscalculia, 80% Other People.

Should our Schools be dumping the label of 'DISABLED' onto children?
Or instead be concerned with recognising the Individual Difference in each child's way of learning/thinking?
Yet currently, the label of Disabled, is seen as progress. As prior to this, a child is accused of being either Stupid or Lazy and Not Trying Hard Enough.
On a daily basis for year after year.
[Which I would equate with Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome?]

Not Disabled, just Different?
Geoff.

Why should we expect every child to be different,

obviously every child has vastly different experience if we take any classroom of the thirty children of five years of age,
365 days of five years gives our children 1825 days of differing experiences some of those experiences will be of acommon nature,
though many of those experiences will be extremely different, why should we continue to look at the difference
within the brains of the children, when it is most likely that the brains of the children have together much more similarity,
then the experience that those individual children have naturally lived through. Within the close study of my own grandchildren,
ther is vastly different experiences taking place, those experiences themselves deliver differing awareness.

Whithin my grandchildren, if you take the starting point of speech alone it is vastly different, the firstborn child is given more attention
then the second child, partly because the parents antisipate the childs every wish,speaking early it is not as essential to speak quickly
as it is for the second child fighting for recognition.

If we then consider the differing aproach of parents
and the priority that they give to teaching their own child it is hardly surprising that thirty children,
in a reception class have 30 different levels of ability. Close study of synthetic phonics has recently
impressed the British government to re-adopt this system of teaching which guaranteed. Virtually every child
the ability to read at least haltingly within one year of attending primary school before the Second World War.

Many successful teachers during the last 60 years of reception schoolchildren
have taught in the same manner and obviously achieved
successful results, ignoring the latest fad.

The moment the children are gathered together in a reception class. Logical step by step teaching has to take place
no matter what children are further ahead, the class has to move through common experience, those common experiences, will
naturally be absorbed at differing rates, and depending entirely upon previous experiences, it is my strongly held belief through observation
that this preschool experiences explains differing levels of achivement, within healthy children, rather than looking for
fondly kinky differences within what is natural brain ability. Virtually every healthy child can teach itself to speak,
and every healthy child can be taught to drive a car, no matter what intellectual achievement may be visible.

April 10, 2006
Good Morning,
Good, Good, Good, Subject.......

New age medicines and treatments for serious and less than serious diseases are being subjected to thorough scrutiny and encouragement to individualize medications and those important procedures in degenerative diseases is beginning to take shape. The cases of MS and Parkinson's disease etc. etc. scientist are encouraging earlier treatment of symptoms so that as in the case of Parkinson's disease the accepted general clinical comfirmation of this disease has been when a substantial number of dopaminergic neurons die in the Basal Ganglia [substantia nigra] that the physical motor effects are clinically manifest. This is like waiting for approximately three quarters of these cells to die so that comfirmation will be correct. It is a very difficult disease to dx. Now doctors are looking at more than just the physical conditions of parkinson's disease that the individual is experiencing. Medications such as dopamine agonist and L'Dopa may be administer before the cells die inorder to ascertain the effect of the medication on the disease itself...in other words, might it slow down the cell death. Doctors have a very difficult time with dx so many different motor associated diseases located in the brain stem.
Best,
Rob

Susan posted an insightful question on the CERI forms ( http://www.ceri-forums.org/forums )Her question was: Is there such a thing as a 'normal' brain? Who gets to decide what's normal?

The question posed by Susan is an important one. Indeed, individual differences are the norm, not the exception. This point cannot be overstated. Findings reported about ‘the brain,’ or subgroups such as ‘the adult brain,’ represent approximations based upon averages. In fact, each brain is unique. However, it is useful to identify functionally significant typical and atypical features for purposes of intervention. These classifications have important utility but the key is that classifications are not value-laden, which is why experts in the field prefer to use the word ‘typical’ rather than ‘normal.’

This is an critical issue and worth discussing.

All the best,
Christina

One of the things that I am required to do frequently is respond to students or parents (particularly parents) who want to know why their or thier son/daughter has a brain that doesn't "work right" and if only they were "normal", can we "fix" them, etc... Anyway, I don't really have any scientific evidence to back this up, but my response usually is that your brain can only do so much and oftentimes my students with dyslexia or dyscalculia or dysgraphia, etc... certainly have something they are very good at or know a lot about. If that child would have been "normal", that would basically mean that their brain would've developed differently. She would have been more average in the areas she is now strong in and would not be as interesting as she has grown to be. We then work to help strengthen those weaknesses while continuing to build the strengths, but always want to keep in mind that the "brain power" that would have been used to develop those phonological skills were going somewhere else and we don't want to waste that gift as we work on the hard stuff.

I don't know if that makes as much sense without some firmer context and the hand gestures and specific examples that are usually included , but I know that we work to answer that question for our students every day at the school I work in. Thanks for asking it to a much bigger audience Christina!

Hi Ldtchr,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this. It is great to hear from forum members who have the perspective of working with children with dyslexia on a daily basis. It sounds like you are doing a great job with these children. The dual approach of developing reading skills while at the same time nurturing talents has many benefits, including preserving the children’s self-esteem as well as developing interests that can provide motivation to read.

It is interesting that you commonly notice talents affiliated with dyslexia because there is growing evidence that dyslexia may be associated with a particular visual-spatial talents (see above discussion). While there is not a certain about of “brain power” that is distributed, the pairing of strengths and weakness that you describe does often occur because deficits can often lead to compensatory strengths.

Thanks so much for your insights!
~Christina